Conscient Podcast: é60 boutet – à la recherche d’un esprit collectif

Collectivement, on est inconscient. On cherche à parler de la conscience écologique. On cherche à parler de ça, mais en réalité… S’il y a une psyché collective, ce que je crois, je pense qu’il y a une espèce d’esprit collectif, mais c’est un esprit qui est inconscient, qui n’est pas capable de se voir aller, de se réfléchir et donc pas capable de méditer, pas capable de se transformer, donc soumis à ses peurs et ses pulsions. Je suis assez pessimiste par rapport à ça, mais c’est que le deuil écologique, tout le chagrin et toute la peur est refoulée présentement. Il y a des activistes qui crient dans le désert, qui hurlent, et les gens entendent, mais comme dans un brouillard. Ce n’est pas suffisant pour amener à une action collective. Donc, le deuil il est loin d’être fait, collectivement.

dr. danielle boutet, balado conscient, 24 juin 2021, rimouski

Danielle Boutet, Ph.D., est chercheure en pratique des arts. Après un doctorat portant sur les dimensions épistémologiques du processus créateur en art, elle s’intéresse à l’expérience artistique: c’est-à-dire l’expérience de l’artiste en lien avec la création, et quels sont les sens de cette expérience dans l’ensemble de l’expérience humaine. Elle approche cette question d’un point de vue phénoménologique et autoethnologique – notamment via les récits de pratique. Spécialiste de l’intermédialité et de l’interdisciplinarité dans les arts, et plus spécialement du processus créateur dans ces nouveaux champs artistiques, une part de ses recherches portent sur un ensemble d’habiletés et de notions communes à tous les arts, sorte d’arrière-plan non-disciplinaire ou infra-disciplinaire, permettant aux artistes d’appliquer les savoirs et savoir-faire de leur médium d’origine à de nouveaux médiums et à de nouvelles pratiques artistiques. Dans une perspective transdisciplinaire, elle envisage l’art comme une forme de connaissance à part entière parmi les autres formes de connaissance, et postule sa complémentarité dans toute connaissance du réel, aux côtés de la science, de la philosophie et des grandes herméneutiques telles la psychanalyse, les spiritualités, et autres. Elle étudie également les nouvelles pratiques artistiques, notamment l’art relationnel, l’art en communauté et l’art activiste.

Je connais à Danielle Boutet depuis 1999 au début de ma carrière au Conseil des arts du Canada. Au cours des années, elle a eu une grande influence sur mon évolution dans ce secteur. Voici un billet qu’elle a écrit en 2016 qui fait le point sur nos collaboration au Conseil : L’interdisciplinarité a la non-disciplinarité. J’étais très heureux de renouer un dialogue sur l’art avec Danielle dans le cadre de ce balado. Toujours engagée et réfléchie, nous avons eu bel échange. Ces deux citations en particulier m’ont touché :

Changer notre rapport à la nature 

Il faut arriver à changer notre rapport à la nature, notre façon d’entrer en relation avec les autres et ce n’est pas là la science généralisant qui va nous dire, c’est cette espèce de science du singulier et de l’expérience de chacun. Pour moi, c’est vraiment un grand domaine d’innovation, de recherche et je vois que les artistes s’en vont dans cette direction. Tu sais, toi et moi, on observe les changements dans le monde de l’art depuis les années 1990. Moi, je vois ça à travers les artistes qui en parlent de plus en plus et intègrent de plus en plus leur réflexion dans leur démarche. 

Comment l’art peut aider les humains à évoluer

J’entends beaucoup des gens qui appellent les artistes à intervenir, des artistes aussi qui disent qu’il faut faire quelque chose, etc. Je trouve que l’art ce n’est pas un bon véhicule pour l’activisme. Je suis vraiment désolé pour tous ceux qui s’intéressent à ça. Je ne veux pas choquer personne, mais parfois ça peut risquer de tomber dans la propagande ou de tomber dans l’idéologie ou dans une sorte de facilité qui me désole au sens où je pense que l’art peut faire tellement plus que ça et aller tellement plus profondément que ça. L’art peut aider les humains à évoluer. C’est à ce niveau-là que je pense qu’on était comment on pourrait vraiment avoir une action, mais je pense qu’on l’a toujours eu cette action-là et il suffit de la relancer encore et encore et encore.

Je remercie Danielle d’avoir pris le temps d’échanger avec moi et de partager sa vision du monde, ses réflexions en profondeur sur l’art et son esprit d’ouverture et d’exploration. 

Vous trouverez de plus amples informations sur Danielle Boutet a https://www.uqar.ca/universite/a-propos-de-l-uqar/departements/departement-de-psychosociologie-et-travail-social/boutet-danielle et https://danielleboutet.wordpress.com

Liens

https://conseildesarts.ca/pleins-feux/2016/08/de-l-interdisciplinarite-a-la-non-disciplinarite

*

(translation)

Collectively, we are unconscious. We try to talk about ecological consciousness. If there is a collective psyche, which I believe there is, I do think there is a kind of collective mind, but it is a mind that is unconscious, that is not capable of seeing itself, of reflecting and therefore not capable of meditating, not capable of transforming itself, and therefore subject to its fears and its impulses. I am quite pessimistic about this, in the sense that ecological grief, all grief and all fear is repressed at the moment. There are activists shouting in the wilderness, screaming, and people are listening, but in a fog. It is not enough to bring about collective action. Therefore, our grieving is far from being done, collectively.

dr. danielle boutet, conscient podcast, june 24, 2021, rimouski

Danielle Boutet, Ph.D., is a researcher in arts practice. After completing a doctorate on the epistemological dimensions of the creative process in art, she is interested in the artistic experience: that is, the experience of the artist in relation to creation, and what are the meanings of this experience in the whole of human experience. She approaches this question from a phenomenological and autoethnological point of view – in particular via the narratives of practice. As a specialist in intermediality and interdisciplinarity in the arts, and more specifically in the creative process in these new artistic fields, part of her research focuses on a set of skills and notions common to all the arts, a sort of non-disciplinary or infra-disciplinary background, allowing artists to apply the knowledge and know-how of their medium of origin to new mediums and new artistic practices. In a transdisciplinary perspective, it considers art as a form of knowledge in its own right among other forms of knowledge, and postulates its complementarity in any knowledge of reality, alongside science, philosophy and the great hermeneutics such as psychoanalysis, spiritualities, and others. She also studies new artistic practices, notably relational art, art in community and activist art.

I have known Danielle Boutet since 1999 when I started my career at the Canada Council for the Arts. Over the years, she has had a great influence on my evolution in this sector. Here is a post she wrote in 2016 that summarizes our collaborations at the Council: From Interdisciplinarity to Non-disciplinarity. I was thrilled to re-engage in a dialogue about art with Danielle on this podcast. Always engaging and thoughtful, we had a great exchange. These two quotes caught my attention in particular:

Changing our relationship to nature 

We need to change our relationship to nature, our way of relating to others, and it’s not the generalizing science that’s going to tell us, it’s this kind of science of the singular and the experience of each person. For me, it is really a great field of innovation, of research and I see that the artists are going in this direction. You and I have been watching the changes in the art world since the 1990s. I see it through the artists who talk about it more and more and integrate their reflection in their approach. 

How art can help humans evolve

I hear a lot of people calling for artists to intervene and of artists also saying that something must be done, etc. I think that art is not a good vehicle for activism. I’m really sorry for all the people who are interested in this. I don’t want to shock anyone, but sometimes it can risk falling into propaganda or ideology or a kind of facility that I am sorry about, in the sense that I think art can do so much more than that and go so much deeper than that. Art can help humans to evolve. It is at this level that I think that we can really have action, but I think that we have always had this action, and it is a question of doing it over and over and over again.

I thank Danielle for taking the time to exchange with me and share her worldview, her deep thinking on art and her spirit of openness and exploration. 

You can find more information about Danielle Boutet at https://www.uqar.ca/universite/a-propos-de-l-uqar/departements/departement-de-psychosociologie-et-travail-social/boutet-danielle (in French) and https://danielleboutet.wordpress.com/in-english/

Links

From https://canadacouncil.ca/spotlight/2016/08/from-interdisciplinarity-to-nondisciplinarity

The post é60 boutet : à la recherche d’un esprit collectif appeared first on conscient podcast / balado conscient. conscient is a bilingual blog and podcast (French or English) by audio artist Claude Schryer that explores how arts and culture contribute to environmental awareness and action.

———-

About the Concient Podcast from Claude Schryer

The conscient podcast / balado conscient is a series of conversations about art, conscience and the ecological crisis. This podcast is bilingual (in either English or French). The language of the guest determines the language of the podcast. Episode notes are translated but not individual interviews.

I started the conscient project in 2020 as a personal learning journey and knowledge sharing exercise. It has been rewarding, and sometimes surprising.

The term ‘conscient’ is defined as ‘being aware of one’s surroundings, thoughts and motivations’. My touchstone for the podcast is episode 1, e01 terrified, based on an essay I wrote in May 2019, where I share my anxiety about the climate crisis and my belief that arts and culture can play a critical role in raising public awareness about environmental issues. The conscient podcast / balado conscient follows up on my http://simplesoundscapes.ca (2016–2019) project: 175, 3-minute audio and video field recordings that explore mindful listening.

Season 1 (May to October 2020) explored how the arts contribute to environmental awareness and action. I produced 3 episodes in French and 15 in English. The episodes cover a wide range of content, including activism, impact measurement, gaming, arts funding, cross-sectoral collaborations, social justice, artistic practices, etc. Episodes 8 to 17 were recorded while I was at the Creative Climate Leadership USA course in Arizona in March 2020 (led by Julie’s Bicycle). Episode 18 is a compilation of highlights from these conversations.

Season 2 (March 2021 – ) explores the concept of reality and is about accepting reality, working through ecological grief and charting a path forward. The first episode of season 2 (e19 reality) mixes quotations from 28 authors with field recordings from simplesoundscapes and from my 1998 soundscape composition, Au dernier vivant les biens. One of my findings from this episode is that ‘I now see, and more importantly, I now feel in my bones, ‘the state of things as they actually exist’, without social filters or unsustainable stories blocking the way’. e19 reality touches upon 7 topics: our perception of reality, the possibility of human extinction, ecological anxiety and ecological grief, hope, arts, storytelling and the wisdom of indigenous cultures. The rest of season 2 features interviews with thought leaders about their responses and reactions to e19 reality.

my professional services

I’ve been retired from the Canada Council for the Arts since September 15, 2020 where I served as a senior strategic advisor in arts granting (2016-2020) and manager of the Inter-Arts Office (1999-2015). My focus in (quasi) retirement is environmental issues within my area of expertise in arts and culture, in particular in acoustic ecology. I’m open to become involved in projects that align with my values and that move forward environmental concerns. Feel free to email me for a conversation : claude@conscient.ca

acknowledgement of eco-responsibility

I acknowledge that the production of the conscient podcast / balado conscient produces carbon. I try to minimize this carbon footprint by being as efficient as possible, including using GreenGeeks as my web server and acquiring carbon offsets for my equipment and travel activities from BullFrog Power and Less.

a word about privilege and bias

While recording episode 19 ‘reality’, I heard elements of ‘privilege’ in my voice that I had not noticed before. It sounded a bit like ‘ecological mansplaining’. I realize that, in spite of good intentions, I need to work my way through issues of privilege (of all kinds) and unconscious bias the way I did through ecological anxiety and grief during the fall of 2020. My re-education is ongoing.

Go to conscient.ca

Powered by WPeMatico

%d bloggers like this: